Docks

[Will.B]

One of the most important changes over the years in the Newham area must surely have been the closure of the Royal Docks, I think this removed the very heart from the borough and was the very end of c-ckney life in Newham as we then knew it. I know it was progress and some people will say look at the nice new flats and buildings around the docks now, but if I took my Grandchildren for a tour round the docks today, would they get the same thrill out of it as I did when my Father first took me round there many years ago? I am sure they would not.
I was not a Docker as such but for many years I worked on nearly all the ships that used the Royal Docks and I never got tired of going to work there. The dock workers had some bad press at times but did a very dangerous job and they had a wonderful sense of humour, if you were on the quayside, in Georges Café or over West Ham Football on a Saturday afternoon it would not be long before they would have you laughing loud. Sometimes listening to the comments they made over West Ham were more funny and entertaining than the match, the sense of humour they had was similar to that of the Liverpool Dockers so perhaps it was unique to the docks.
Will.   

[ALANF]

Will

As a boy, most of our neighbours were dockers, and you are right about the sense of humour. When people have very little, I think that it is the humour that keeps them going.
Speaking of which, I remember a player for West Ham in their 2nd division days by the name of Wragg. He was given the nickname of 'Oily'. Being a bit slow on the uptake for a small boy, it took me a little while to work out why they had given him this nickname!

Alan

[Albert]

Hi Will,
As an ex docker I would say you were right. Many dockers had a nickname and they were usually quite funny if you knew the context from which they arose.
I can remember Lugsy, Soap, Knacker, Killer and Wonderboy among many others.
I'm sure there are many other ex dockers who will know these men and will also be able to add to these.

Albert

[Will.B]

Here is a poem that I first wrote and posted on the old website which is now inaccessible so as I think this is a little bit of Newham's history,I am posting it here again.Will.

THE DEMISE OF
 LONDON'S ROYAL DOCKS (1981/2)

Oh how sad to see our Royal Docks
With grass growing tall around quays and locks
These Docks were once like a busy City-
Now desolate,abandoned and full of pity.
It's giant cranes that were so regal
Slowly rusting away-not wanted by people
Seagulls now swoop over this silent space,
Disturbed once a year by a power boat race.
Gone are the ships that came in on the tide,
With cargoes aplenty from far and wide,
Gone are the Dockers,Stevedores and Riggers too,
Chinese,Indian and Lascar crews.
But where are the goods we get from all nations?
They now come in by containerisation,
No more the sound of a ship's engine as she waits to depart,
Like some large friendly monster with beating heart.
Instead they talk of an Airport here now,
With Aeroplane wings replacing ship's bows.
But what would our forefathers say if they saw these Docks now-?
These Docks that they built with the sweat of their brow,
What would they do? what would be said?
Nothing I fear,just a shake of their heads.
So now we accept these Docks have come to their end,
like the passing away of an old C-ckney friend.
Will.B.

[ed styles]

This is a response to the postings of Nov last year, relating to the witty humour of Dock workers who I was privileged to work along side in the 60s and early 70s,
When you first started work there you were singled out if there was anything slightly unusual about you ,and from then on you carried that name around till you left the Docks.
 These are some I can remember,as a former ships carpenter, Alf the Bond Street Joiner, Toffee Wrapper ,Boom Boom,and a Timey at Silley,s called Ask me Dad .
A few I remember when Iworked as a Docker were Catweasel, Jonny Goldfinger, Joe the Nose,  memory now gone into melt down ah well they were happy times .
  All the best ed

[Will.B]

When I now see what’s left of the Docks and the how quiet the river now is, it seems hard to believe that we was once a nautical nation. The ships have now gone and it makes me wonder whether future generations will realize how much those wonderful ships( from sail to steam, in peace time and in war) and their brave crews did  to put the Great in Great Britain .

[Bill Sharpe]

Hear Hear Will,

I have often said that my Grandfather's and father's service in the Merchant Navy during the second World War was much different to my service in the sixties. Nevertheless we all 3 succeeded in keeping the country fed - bless 'em all that what I say.


Bill

[stevenjhc]

I have recently discovered this extraordinary forum when pulling together my family story.

I grew up on my grandad's knee listening to tales about his early life in Canning Town, and later at Woolwich and I must say that the docks were always in his stories somewhere. Always. That and "Old Father Thames".

And do you know what I have found out this week?

Well, I have traced his father, grandfather, great garndfather, and great great grandfather and all of them were born by and worked on the river. St Georges, Poplar, Barnes, Deptford....all the way back. I have to say, and I speak now as a professional worker who has never lived in London, removing these industries from the banks of the Thames is shortsighted beyond belief. Those industries had been there for centuries.

And I'll make a wager with anyone that cares to take me on.

Those riverside industries will be back in the heart of London long before this century reaches the halfway mark. Sometimes you just gota have a little faith.

[Bert]

Unfortunately, container ships and their ports of call have put paid to the rejuvenation of London Docks.

[ed styles]

 Steven, welcome to the Board,
                                          I'd happily take your wager on, however we've only got 38 years to your 1/2 centuary, and I won't be around to collect.
On a serious note, take a trip down river from the Pool of London on a river bus, and just see how many Wharves and Warehouses have been converted to expensive appartments and Hotels, this carries on all the way to Gallions Reach by the entrance to the K.G.V. ( the Royals )  Dock entrance Locks , and later possibly on to Barking Creek .
The Lighterage Industry has almost gone , the Docks and related Industries completly vanished, and you would have to go as far as Tilbury to see any major Shipping movements.
I've grown up and worked in the Dock Industry, carrying on 4 generations of River and Dock work, yes I'd love to see it happen, but the Writing was on the wall in the 60's .

   All the best Ed

[MickG]

If you use Google Earth's historical imagery feature, it is possible to overlay a 1945 aerial map across the docks. It amazing just how many ships there were in the Royals and the Indies  which stand out quite clearly. The imagery shows for some reason the Surrey Docks was practically empty of shipping in 1945, but at least you can see the docks which sadly have now almost been filled in for housing development.

[Will.B]

Hi Steven,
I’d like to think you are right but I doubt it will ever happen, in the Newham Recorder this week even such a famous company as Tate and Lyle are under threat. The article states that they are operating at 60 per cent capacity because the European Commission has stopped them from importing more sugar cane from Commonwealth Countries and instead favoured increasing sugar beet quotas on the Continent and so the long term sustainability is under threat.

I think if more people with West Ham, East Ham and Newham ancestors were to start their family tree they would find many of their ancestors were connected with ships and the sea. I worked aboard ships in the Royal Docks and when I was doing my family tree I found that apart from a few of my family working in those docks at that time, I also found my Grandfather and two Uncles sailed out of the docks in the 1920s, then even further back I found that my Great, Great Grandfather was a Royal Marine serving aboard the H.M.S Caesar in 1860.
Will

[Bill Sharpe]

I agree with you Will on the devastating effect that the closure of the docks on Newham. Some time ago I wrote a fictional story about the this subject - it was published on the old site under the title 'Nightmare in Custom House, some of the members might already have seen this but I thought I thought it would tie in with your previous comments and have decided to put it back on site.

                                                                                                        NIGHTMARE IN CUSTOM HOUSE

Alf stretched his arms wearily, leaned across to switch off the wireless, and said,
“ Time we was off to bed Ivy. Big day tomorrow, we’ve got to be up early, to help set up for the street party.”
   The date was May 8 1945 and the  street party Alf was referring too, was to celebrate V.E. Day, Victory in Europe. The German army had finally surrendered, Hitler was dead and the lights were going back on all over Europe. At least they knew now that Johnny and Harry boy were safe and should soon return home. It was different for their other two sons, Tom was still fighting the Japs in the far East and Bill was a prisoner of War somewhere in Burma.
   Alf got into bed and fell quickly into a deep sleep, until. . . . . .
“ Alf! Wake up!”
“ Wassa matter, what’s wrong!”
“ You must have had a nightmare love, you was thrashing about and groaning something awful.”
   Alf stared at Ivy with bloodshot eyes.
“ It was awful. I dreamed that I was working at A shed down the Vic Dock. Only thing is, when I got there, everything was gone. No sheds, no warehouses, no ships, no flour mills, no barges or tugs, no dockers.”
   Ivy looked at him curiously.
“ If nothing was there, then ‘ow dya  know that you was in the docks, you daft old sod!”
“ Well,” said Alf irritably, “ the dock itself was still there, but there were sailing dinghies and posh little motor boats instead of ships. On the Custom House side of the docks there was lots of hotels and there was even one ship tied up near A shed, but it was a hotel and restaurant, not a cargo ship. I saw lots of cars there, they were all different colours, I asked a bloke where they come from, and he told me that they were mostly German and Japanese cars. Then I realized, we must have lost the war and the German invaders had taken over the docks. On the Silvertown side of the docks they had built themselves posh flats for their families, they had even built an airfield between the Albert and K.G.5 and huge planes were flying in and out carrying supplies and probably troops from Germany. There was even a big modern warehouse there, where they must have kept their weapons, it was called the Excel centre. There was a big sign there sayings ’Arms Fair’, the building was surrounded by Coppers, but they couldn’t have been British because they were all wearing bullet proof jackets and some of them were armed with machine-guns.”
“ Sounds a bit far fetched to me.” said Ivy.

“It gets a lot worse than that,” Said Alf with a grimace. “ I got scared and ran out of the docks. The first thing I noticed was that the ‘Connaught’ was closed down. I ran along the Marsh (Victoria Dock Road) and saw that the ‘Steps’ had gone as well. When I got to Freemasons Road, The ‘Cartridges’ had gone, and the ‘Masons‘ Walking further up I saw that the ’Gog’ and the ‘Peacock had gone too. I cut through Becton Park and saw that they’d filled in the Lido. I walked up Prince Regents Lane and it was even worse, they had demolished West Ham Stadium. The ‘Nott’ and the ‘Prince of Wales ‘ had also gone. They had even shut down the working mans club in Berwick Road. I was upset I tell you. I sat down by a bus stop to have a fag, and a copper told me that it was against the law to smoke at bus stops.“

“ What was our people doing while all this was going on?“ Asked Ivy.
“ Not many of them was left. They must have been killed or taken prisoner when the Germans invaded us. The Germans had turned the whole of Custom house into one big concentration camp and filled it with people, probably forced labour, from all over the World. I heard people with Russian, Polish, Slav, Rumanian, accents, I saw thousands of Africans, Arabs and Indians, they were obviously there to work for the Germans. It was horrible, the whole place had turned into a dump.”
   Ivy turned to him as she got out of their bed.
“ Don’t worry about it, Alf. We’ve just won the War. Nothing like that’s gonna happen round here.”
“ Yeah, you’re right girl.” Replied Alf in a relieved voice. “ Thank God. It was all just a bad dream.”

[Will.B]

 Thanks Bill, that's brilliant.Will

[Tony_H]

The history of Newham, especially Canning Town, Tidal Basin and the Docks is highly political and for the sake of future generations should never be forgotten, keep on posting about the Docks, the Arms Dealers of Excel and poverty.